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RT90 maps and coordinates
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Ranger



Joined: 12 Dec 2006
Posts: 6030

PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 1:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

marmeladburk wrote:
uhm.. ok...
But all swedish maps are in RT90. Shouldn't I still be able to use them in trekbuddy with a GPS? I can use them in OziExplorer and Fugawi with no problem. After calibration I just choose WGS84 for coordinate system and the application converts everything for me.

But why you think, that you couldn't in TB ?
Problem is the way you try use the map.

marmeladburk wrote:

I tried once to hack up my own .map file for the map by converting the grid coordinates in the corners to WGS84. The problem then was that I couldn't get trekbuddy to understand that it should still use the swedish projection. Maybe I did something wrong there. Well I actually got the .map file to work in Ozi correctly as WGS84 with swedish projection. Something is fishy Wink

Don't hack .map file. Changing map datum to WGS84 doesn't mean that you have WGS working, you just have wrong map.
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marmeladburk



Joined: 31 Dec 2006
Posts: 20

PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 1:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ranger wrote:

But why you think, that you couldn't in TB ?
Problem is the way you try use the map.

Well I don't really see any other way of using it. I import the map in Ozi as DRG. Ozi automatically calibrates the map from the information in the supplied .tfw file. I get a .map file. Slice the map up in TBCutter and move the files to the phone. I do nothing in between. The differens is that in Ozi I can add a waypoint in WGS84 and it ends up in the right place. In TrekBuddy I can't.

Ranger wrote:

Don't hack .map file. Changing map datum to WGS84 doesn't mean that you have WGS working, you just have wrong map.

Well I didn't just change the datum. I recalculated the calibration points to WGS84 keeping the projection settings. It seemed to work fine in Ozi but not in TB.
Then again, doing that is actually wrong. The way I see it the map should have worked out of the box with the process I stated above.
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Ranger



Joined: 12 Dec 2006
Posts: 6030

PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 2:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for map.
To easy understand datums difference you can do something in OziE.
Just choose RT90, turn on Lat/Lon and Swedish grids and just save map with grids. Next do the same for WGS84 datum modified map and compare both.
If you have map with grids drawn, such difference is visible easy.

@Kruch,
Position difference between S-42 and PND1925 for known geocache sample "Parowy Janinowskie". Not bad !



PND_vs_S-42.png
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PND_vs_S-42.png


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kruch
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Joined: 02 Jul 2006
Posts: 5675

PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 3:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

marmeladburk: what is "bågsekunder" in English?
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marmeladburk



Joined: 31 Dec 2006
Posts: 20

PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 3:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well it should be something like "seconds of an arc" but I'll check what the correct term in "map-terminology" is

*edit*
Haven't found a translation yet but it is 1/3600 degree


Last edited by marmeladburk on Thu Jan 11, 2007 3:39 pm; edited 1 time in total
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kruch
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Joined: 02 Jul 2006
Posts: 5675

PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 3:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks, it's pretty clear from http://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/RT_90, I just wanted to be confident...
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ME



Joined: 22 Sep 2006
Posts: 18

PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 3:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
En bågsekund (1") är 1/3600 av en grad


One bågesekund(1") is 1/3600 of one degree

hope that is a correct translation
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Ranger



Joined: 12 Dec 2006
Posts: 6030

PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 4:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Waiting for TB map ...

Doesn't matter. I can confirm wpt marker position error. Map coords are OK. Wpt coords in RT90 are N57 39,311 E 11 56,588.
See attached pict.



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Last edited by Ranger on Thu Jan 11, 2007 5:04 pm; edited 1 time in total
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kruch
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Joined: 02 Jul 2006
Posts: 5675

PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 4:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I googled a bit.... and my opionion is this: rotations in RT->WGS84 transformation are too big ( 1- 8 arc seconds) and cannot be ignored (unlike S-42 for example - 0.25 arc seconds at most), so a transformation taking rotations into account has to be used.
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Ranger



Joined: 12 Dec 2006
Posts: 6030

PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 5:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kruch,
Position for crosshair is shown well in OSD, marker position not ...
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kruch
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Joined: 02 Jul 2006
Posts: 5675

PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 5:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Position is calculated using grid info only.. but marker goes through WGS84->RT90 first...

I'll implement 7p Helmert tonigth, and we will see the results ... Cool
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Ranger



Joined: 12 Dec 2006
Posts: 6030

PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 5:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I see. Not bad to have more Smile
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Ranger



Joined: 12 Dec 2006
Posts: 6030

PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 8:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The reason of problem is in hardcoded dx, dy, dz (7p not 3p)
For this moment users with RT-90 can use custom datum in .jad

Code:
Datum-11: NRT90{Bessel 1841,498,-36,568}=map:NRT90


but should change datum name in .map file from "RT 90" to "NRT90" by hand



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Last edited by Ranger on Thu Jan 11, 2007 8:57 pm; edited 1 time in total
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marmeladburk



Joined: 31 Dec 2006
Posts: 20

PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 8:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

COOL!! Just tested it on my K800i as well and it works! Thanks!
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kruch
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Joined: 02 Jul 2006
Posts: 5675

PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2007 10:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Where do these values come from? I could not find dx/dy/dz for 3p for RT90...
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